” “Greater consistency in governments

While the world’s political and economic leaders were in New York for the World Economic Forum, the no-global movements were meeting in Porto Alegre in Brazil to discuss the issues of globalization. At the centre of debate at both forums, therefore, were the same issues, though viewed from diametrically opposing perspectives. Mary Robinson , UN High Commissioner for Human Rights, was one of the few personalities who visited both forums. We interviewed her. What idea did you form of the positions represented at Porto Alegre and New York? “I think contacts need to be established between them. My concern when I was in Porto Allegre was to reverse criticisms and protests: in other words, to pass from a position of ‘anti-globalization’ to one of support for an ethical globalization where human rights form part of the rules. Conversely, my message in New York was aimed at pointing out the feelings of alienation generated by globalization based on free trade and on the ideology of open markets”. Can a bridge be built between such different worlds? “It was very interesting to note that the social Forum dealt with economic arguments, whereas the economic Forum was interested in social ones. The perspectives, however, were totally different. If so huge a gulf is to be bridged, greater dialogue needs to be established. But we mustn’t deceive ourselves into thinking that rapprochement between the two camps will be easy. Globalization is worsening the plight of those living in conditions of extreme poverty, but it seems that this situation is not being taken into consideration. The perspective in New York is as follows: so long as there is progress in the economies, then everything is fine. I think that more dialogue is needed. Both camps must listen to each other, even if it is especially New York that must listen more to Porto Alegre”. Can we imagine ever seeing a single forum one day? “Not at the moment. A great deal of time will be needed. Personally, I don’t think this would even be a good idea. The gulf is just too great. The two forums are necessary at the present time”. What do the present structures lack? “I would like to see more links between the various instruments that already exist for the protection of the environment, human rights, children’s rights and labour rights. But these instruments do not figure among the priorities in the discussions of the World Trade Organization (WTO). Foreign Ministers pay visits to the High Commission for Human Rights with magnificent declarations but then Ministers of Finance go to Doha, to the WTO negotiations, with a totally different position. Greater consistency in governments and in the responsibilities of everyone, as in the international organizations, is needed”. What future steps do you envisage to achieve an “ethical globalization”? “I think the approach should be closer to human rights than to an essentially economic perspective. Moreover, I may add that present-day globalization reveals certain shortcomings in its value systems. The values of the market are too strong and in some cases worsen the situation of those excluded from the profits. Promoting human rights means basing the activities of the WTO, the International Monetary Fund (IMF) and the World Bank on a system of values that defends the economic, cultural and social rights of all peoples; that means encouraging the systems of health care and education”.